So what do you think about Phoenix Point being Epic?


#206

My objective would be The Game Crash of 1983, Part 2! Tencent, and by default Epic, should be opposed at every instance. Not long ago, Nvidia attempted to literally shut AMD out of the GPU market with their GeForce Partner Program. After substantial backlash from customers, Nvidia withdrew the program. I strenuously avoid buying Nvidia products, but I made that decision long before GPP. I likewise avoid Intel products for the same reasons. Tencent is attempting to consume the entire global gaming market with practices that are completely acceptable in Chinese culture, but frowned upon in cultures that value putting the customer first, e.g. CD Projekt Red.


#209

I want to ask Snapshot a question…
If those that stick with you, never use the epic key then a year later activate their key on Steam or GoG key. Will they still receive the free DLC?

Also, we now know you break promises at a whim, so how do we know when the years up you will stand by your promise to give out Steam and GoG keys and not just give people some BS excuse why they can’t have one?


#210

Given the actions of Snapshot thus far, and the ongoing responses here on the forum, we may expect the absolute worst from here on out. We are officially beyond the looking glass at this point. hqdefault%20(1)


#212

I didn’t know about the linux cancelation so I can’t comment, but when they signed with Micrososft there was no “you will have to wait for x time to pick the game were you choose”, it was a new option.

I can understand that the game evolves, things changes and that’s okay, I’ve read the Julian’s answer in another thread and I understand this is not an easy solution but we have the Metro example.
In that case the people that pre-ordered in Steam are playing in Steam.

We don’t have that.

Also, I don’t completelly agree with “if you don’t like take your money and get out”, I think people should have the change to have a disccussion about the issues that this decision has for part of the backers.

After one year. One year is a significant amount of time to just ignore easily and it’s a delay forced into some backers, and, in my opinion, there is no technical reason for this.
Well you could say money, but again I come back to Metro, why we can’t have the same deal here? (I suppose because Snapshot is smaller developer than 4A)

Also I don’t agree about the floating base as DLC for this deal, because it was promised for backers before under different conditions.

In my opinion, that’s not right and can lead to a lot of abuse.
Sometimes shit happens and a project could fail, but leaving this door open without even asking anything because it can happen is a dangerous move.

This is the part I would have loved to have a disscussion between backers and developers because I understand the problem here, but I don’t agree with the decision made in the end.

This is a long post and my English it’s not the best, I hope it’s more or less clear.
And don’t read anything as I’m trying to provoke anything I would like to maintain my post and conversation as civilised as possible.


#214

Gollop in the other thread said this, should mean yes:


#215

Well, I think the “Worst part” is over allready, I’ve been having a look at Gog, Steam and Ubisoft to name a few and while they are not exactly “the best”, they have their own games there that you wont get other places.
Thats also why I try to support “small developers” that actually are creative, makes games with good content and focus on exactly that, giving you a good gaming experience that you will remember and come back to play again and again and again.
Guess what, this might be one of those games, I loved the originals in the Xcom series ( even though they had their issues in my point of view ) and I’m really hoping this will live up to it, if it doesnt then ok, I can move along.
Does the platform the game is launched behind really matter that much? Uh oh Chineese freaks spy on me? Did you forget the mobile phone in your pocket that gives away a lot about you? Yeah, todays tech does a lot of things we dont actually like or approve off, but to be honest these pc launchers are not as scary as the other things out there and to be honest If my “Intel” was important I guess someone allready have it…
So honestly I can live with the game going to Epic then later steam etc, I allready have had the epic launcher installed for a time and it works ok enough for me and my kids.


#216

Be Agreeable, Even When You Disagree

You may wish to respond to something by disagreeing with it. That’s fine. But remember to criticize ideas, not people . Please avoid:

  • Name-calling
  • Ad hominem attacks
  • Responding to a post’s tone instead of its actual content
  • Knee-jerk contradiction

Instead, provide reasoned counter-arguments that improve the conversation.

Regards,

Jim


#217

I prefer reasoned counter-arguments and ad homs.


#218

It must have something to do with these veteran developers, they think they can do whatever they like and walk away.
Peter Molineux dumped on his supporters and went back on his promises, David Braben likewise with SP-ED, and now Julian Gollop. They should be setting a example not putting themselves on pedestals.


#219

Molyneux was always a bit “exuberant”, but damn did he make some awesome games. Braben was a one-hit-wonder that parlayed his success with Elite decades ago into a blatant cash grab in 2014. I found out after the fact that Braben sued Ian Bell over a copyright dispute. Elite Dangerous was a Fallout 76 level disaster. The games industry as a whole is nothing like it used to be back in the glory days of the 1990’s. Savants like Larry Holland, Ray Muzyka, Greg Zeschuk, James Ohlen were all either chased out of the industry or sold out. I was clinging to a glimmer of nostalgia when I first heard about PP, but the Epic announcement nuked my last bit of hope in this project.


#220

I found out about Phoenix Point a bit late I think, so I did not back it, I pre-ordered a physical collectors edition.

I do not mind the Epic store, I do like supporting the developers. But… I do not want my physical Phoenix Point to be tied to the Epic store. I have not been able to find anything regarding this. Do we get some options in regards to that?


#222

At the risk of being called a ‘shill’ again by people who don’t even know me, here’s what JG himself has said on the subject.


#223

Yes, and no mention about physical copies at all. What does this mean for the physical copies? As I wrote, I hope to avoid having it tied to the Epic store.


#224

Honestly All the fig early backer should sue snapshot and gallop for such a dirty practice.

Especially after posts like the developer saying that if all the backers refund, they dont care because they are already cover.

Personally Im not buying not now or ever, I donate the money to cpy or codex even if doesnt use denuvo


#225

Here is my response from that thread.

None of this changes the fact you are retracting on a promise you made at the start of your funding. I don’t want this on EPIC, I want it on steam and that is what you promised. You are now holding hostage a game I backed you on because of my love for your previous games.

The way EPIC is trying to dominate the market is through anti-consumer practices and bribery. Oh yes, I am not surprised you are offering refunds because EPIC will reimburse you for those ‘lost sales’ this isn’t a move of the heart but one that costs you nothing! I will be refunding my money knowing full well it is a symbolic gesture. If I actually find your game worth buying in a few years after a massive discount and bugs patched out. I am willing to lose out on my backer benefits for a better product at a worthwhile price down the road…if it is actually worth anything come that time. Backer build three has not inspired me so far.


#226

Can you please give an article in law which would allow for such move? Basis: “Developer would postpone release for my belowed platform. I will sue him in the name of god, law and my grandparents who fought in last war for freedom and justice”. Was the fig info written in stone and could not be altered? Or was it just for reference?

Can you give direct quotation? They really don’t care or it maybe is a rumor?

It is easy to throw accusations when you are angry, but well try to calm down and think what you have written.


#227

An article in law probably not, but it’s certainly a scam

Epic wasn’t there when they need it crowfunding 2 or 3 years ago, they use backers money to get here only to break it and delay the game 1 year for the people not willing to shill to “Epic” store exclusivity deal

On the other note here is some fast quote for you, since Im running late for work

link to rpgcodex.net

The upshot? Snapshot Games don’t need to think about their backers anymore. With the guaranteed sales deal, literally every single backer could refund their money right now and Snapshot would still be in the black


#228

And what was the last sentence of UnstableVoltage? That it wasn’t light decision. You can believe it or not. He was trying to be honest and give you the reason for the change which was made. And you threat that as “fuck you, we don’t care about your money anymore”. If you don’t understand reason behind this then well sue them. I’m really interested who would win in the court. :wink:

PS. Now I wonder if there is some problem with my reasoning or maybe I’m really shilling for Snapshot Games or maybe even Epic Games. :slight_smile:


#229

I have opened this account to relay my disappointment on the matter as well.

I have been a massive X-COM fan for decades now and I was looking forward to this game as the true X-COM rather than Firaxis’ series. But this move is a monumental bad example for gaming industry. I’ll have to wait for Steam launch because every penny that goes to Epic’s malicious methods is a nail in the coffin of PC gaming. I can’t in good conscious look in the mirror if a day comes where every game has to switch to Epic’s “big oil” store that rewards companies, not gamers.


#230

The only pre-orders, which were and are available are for the Epic store. Game was never sold on Steam or gog. You weren’t able to pre-order the game until yesterday.

Crowdfunding is not a preorder. You help to fund the project, you don’t buy a product. You might not even get the game in the end if the project fails. You might receive a very different product than what was pitched. If it is something you can’t accept, you shouldn’t support crowdfunding.

It is only fair to allow refunds, when a project took a turn which might disatisfy original investors. Unlike Metro, Phoenix Point had never put PP on Steam or gog and didn’t generate keys on that platform. Contract with Epic most likely doesn’t allow them to sign in with different platforms.