I’m always looking to support smaller indie devs through stand alone launchers (in this case i was fine with gog) in an attempt to avoid greedy corporate entities that have ruined every one of my favourite franchises.
I found out about Phoenix Point after abandoning another small studio that made it big and decided to go with the Epic Store exclusivity deal. They didn’t bother offering refunds though and instead turned their backs to all their founders and recent backers who were opposed and instead told them to take it or leave.
As dissapointing as the current situation is i think SnapShot ought to be praised for offering refunds and taking responsibility for their decision. I think this deserves it’s own thread because this really needs some more attention in a sea of hate and negativity. I only recently bought in so i’m not as invested into this game as much as the old backers but i do understand the outrage.
Let me be the one in the world who supports Julian Gollop ) If I were to choose between going to Epic and releasing mediocre game, I’d probably choose the first option.
Snapshot has done nothing worthy of praise here. The Fig page still advertises GoG and Steam as distribution options, and clearly a LOT of us chose to back the game in part because of those options. Short of working out a deal to let backers have the distribution options originally promised, this still boils down to a good ol’ bait n’ switch.
Julian’s quote about being able to refund 100% of the backers and still remain in the black is very telling… Snapshot doesn’t give a damn about its backers once their project has been funded. They may want to consider the fact that Epic’s safety net only extends to lost sales on THIS project and won’t mean a damn thing to anyone who actually invested in (as opposed to just backing) Phoenix Point.
I, for one, will not be back to help them fund the next one.
I don’t like the exclusivity deal, and while I can make plenty of excuses which make me fine with it, it does mean that more or less Snapshot sold their backers to Epic.
However, they did offer backers a way out and sweetened the deal if they decide to stick. Offering steam/gog keys a year after makes it a non-issue for me personally, though I feel they should have thought about it before - I can understand why they would see it as “just a different client”, but knowing your playerbase is a key, and people don’t like new, inferior launchers.
I understand disappointment and anger, but the attempts to diabolize the company are quite over the top.
You’re free to be pissed off, and all of us are aware of why people are upset.
There’s hundreds of posts pointing this out.
That has nothing to do with the refunds though which were obviously a token of goodwill and surpisingly they’re getting more shit than the devs who took my money and pretty much told us to fuck off. From most of the posts i’ve read it seems they might aswell not even bothered offering them and just kept the money instead.
They said point blank that the deal with Epic covers their losses even if 100% of backers take the refund, meaning the refund offer costs them nothing. They still got their game off the ground with backer money, and now that it’s funded they’re telling backers to bugger off with zero consequence since daddy Epic is covering their losses.
If you find this no-cost consolation prize to be in any way laudable, your bar is set really low.
Great! I admire their honesty. If there’s one thing i despise then it’s community managers throwing around sales pitches and vague transparency and communication rhetoric which easily fools the gullible fanboys. Straight forward awnsers saying it like it is is always admirable in my book. Even if i dislike the message.
Does Epic cover lost pledges? All I saw was the following discord quote:
Keep in mind that we knew there would be backlash. We knew there would be refunds. If we had to refund 100% of currently pre-orders, we’d still be in the black. We didn’t make the decision lightly
Unless I misunderstand something all it means that deal with Epic is more beneficial to company than ignoring the deal and keeping all backers happy. I don’t think it indicates that lost backer doesn’t equal lost money. It doesn’t mean they don’t appreciate your support (they didn’t throw backers under the bus and they do try to appease the backers. Offering second key is risky, and even though it is what I want, and I am not so sure if it’s a smart idea. Some people for sure will try to resell keys with DLCs).
It sounds like you are more hurt that Snapshot doesn’t need us anymore, rather than focusing on the actual offer they presented. Maybe I just didn’t put enough money on the line to be emotionally attached to this project.
They are offering the refund because they don’t lose any money. This literally costs them nothing to do so that is why they are doing it. They closed out the people that helped them get this far and didn’t even get a plan to grandfather us in. I was gonna wait for PP tp go on sale at some point but the more I think on this not only am I glad I refunded I will not ever buy it, and that hurts me because I love X-COM I have a game going on right now!
You’re missing the point. It does have a cost. The money they get from the migration is irrelavent because they choose to pay us back when they might aswell have double dipped since people are even giving them shit for the one thing they did right. As i pointed out in my original post i’ve seen it happen. Keep in mind i’m ok with giving them shit because they deserve it.
Does Fig page have to change even if it is over and don’t accept new backers? There could be even part about Linux and about being exclusive to PC. But those things can change.
And you want to tell me that backers decided to fund this game because of Steam? “Fuck it, I don’t know what this game is about but hey! It has Steam or GOG options so it must be good. I will back it!” Sure, and I’m the king of small utopia.
You can’t actually make changes to the Fig page once it has gone life except adding extra stuff in. Once the Fig campaign has ended, you can’t change anything.
At the very least, it’s good of them to offer refunds. Bloodstained, another project I backed, dropped Mac and Linux support and didn’t even offer refunds, the Mac/Linux backers are pretty angry Still, it is an inconvenience to get refunds, particularly taking into account both fees and the annoyance of having something you were really looking forward to end up selling out
Refund is not the option to give to backers. The ones that helped shaping the game are trashed out in the bin !! There is nothing to praise here. The only good thing to be worthy for those who supported the game is a DRM free launcher out of Epic Game Store (which is still against European Laws).
Steam / GoG key in one year don’t care of it. It is at the LAUNCH of the game that founders / backers should be able to play without the Epic Store.
I’m not sure morality is really the issue here; this is clearly a move in a game of corporate politics. But if it is about morality, breaking someones heart surely has to count for something.
This is more about corporate strategies that is against consumers than everything else. As for my heart, it was allready broken by Coffee Stain with Satisfactory that made the same move.
It won’t cost you anything to sign up to Epic games to play Phoenix Point. PC gaming is totally dominated by Steam and it’s a company that is just making money without putting very much of it back into actual production of quality games we can enjoy. Every software developer is trying to break that monopoly even if only for the sake of their own profit margins…
1/ Epic store does not comply to European laws so it is a no go.
2/ Epic Store is not consumer friendly and price cuts don’t make games cheaper for us
3/ False Advertising is punished by laws, i spend money with the option of using steam or GoG, not Epic Store. They broke the bargain, they need to fix it. They offer a refund that i do not want. I want my game as advertised. Options : DRM free launcher and updater.
OK, so Epic might not be the winner in this scenario.
I paid my money and I read some of the small print; I was getting a digital copy of the game when it was released and I wasn’t given any specifics for that.
Redux: Consumers don’t have any say whatsoever; we’re only protected by the conditions of the market.
There could be even part about Linux and about being exclusive to PC. But those things can change.
Sure, and I’m the king of small utopia. 
Still, it is an inconvenience to get refunds, particularly taking into account both fees and the annoyance of having something you were really looking forward to end up selling out 