lol well if your using terminator builds, your playing the wrong game sorry. That’s not maximum efficiency. It’s taking advantage of unintended combinations.
I don’t, but those who do certainly do not “play the wrong game”. Read my post again. Try to understand its content.
How do you know which combinations are intended and which are not?
I read your post (assuming your meaning the one directly above). I’m not agreeing with it.
Well ok. Your response contains no arguments whatsoever. It’s just a “they play the wrong game” while I only tangentially addressed terminator builds. Thats not how discussions work. You are disqualified.
By the way, I agree that builds that trivialize the content should not exist, but that again is a different matter and goes deeper than just some OP ability combos. It’s a fundamental design flaw generally leading to indispensable super soldiers unless you simply never spend any SP. You can’t just say well don’t play these builds problem solved - and if you do you don’t matter. That’s just nuts !
I think it is you that “plays the wrong game”.
By that, I’m going by posts from the devs. We had a big thread on this topic a few weeks ago which delved into it in extensive detail.
It must be the weekend!
So if I feel that people playing with Terminator builds are playing the wrong game, that I am? That’s just stupid.
Anyways. Read all I’m basing this off is from this thread:
And examples of terminator builds:
https://www.reddit.com/r/PhoenixPoint/comments/ea0fnk/ok_you_win_maybe_the_balance_is_a_little_off_i/
So there ya go. Unintended. And that is my argument. It’s the same as using an exploit. Until it is nerfed into not being as strong as it currently is. Until I clearly knew what a terminator build was, I was of the exact same opinion as yourself. That it’s just using a combination of skills built into the game, and making effective use of them.
Have a read of the thread I linked as it goes into it all in extensive detail.
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Yeah there are combinations that are unintended. Which ones are they?
Interestingly when using a Terminator build (I have) the dynamic difficulty adjustment (DDA) becomes very punishing. The armour and volume of enemy units can be quite difficult. You will probably need a Terminator for each squad of soldiers. If not then the game can become unpleasant. There is a way around it but that’s another situation.
The most detail on your question can be found in that thread I linked. And you can see it in action, in the video.
Without finding the exact posts which detailed it precisely, and going completely off memory, it’s with use of the ability that gives 2 action points per kill, and done in such a fashion (eg with use of dash, to get into the right position), to set off a chain of attacks that effectively eliminates nearly all opposition within a super short time frame. Putting the computer in such a position that it has next to no chance by it’s turn. So like alpha striking, but on a far greater scale.
So if you watch the video, the person eliminates nearly all Pandoran enemies in a very short time frame. Make sense?
So it’s all of those used in combination. I’ve never seen that happen in-game myself. And from what I’ve seen from videos of the final mission (as I’ve yet to reach it), it may even be required there due to the massive amount of enemies present which presents the need for a major revamp of it (in terms of balancing).
I absolutely agree, as do most of the perceived ‘hardcore’ voices on these forums.
Which is why I consistently bang the drum of Difficulty choices and Second Wave Options.
This game has progressed massively since its Dec 3rd release, when the DDA was so unforgiving that it made even playing on Easy Difficulty murderously difficult for anyone who didn’t take his casualties as they came. But it has the XCOM inverse difficulty curve in spades, and the devs know they need to address that.
As I constantly keep saying: Easy & Veteran should be easy; but Heroic & Legendary should force you to play like Heroes and Legends to survive. It hasn’t happened yet, but we’re getting there.
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Ok so as long as we don’t spam Rapid Clearance we aren’t exploiting the game? How many time do I have to use it in a row for it to be considered an exploit? 2, 3, 4?
What about Rally the Troops as well?
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To be fair on Icemann, you’re misrepresenting his argument.
He understands that TBs need to be fixed - and that there is more to TBs than just Rapid Clearance. That was simply the key example that he plucked out of the air.
As one of the so-called ‘hardcore’ calling for change, I kinda agree with him. I don’t use TBs, refuse to use Rage Burst with anything but machine-guns and limit myself to 2 Rallies/turn - and within those self-limitations the game is great!
But I also recognise that there are players out there who find the game murderously hard, without any self-imposed limitations.
Ultimately, to be successful, the game will have to find a way to cater for both of those extremes. And the devs are working hard on a whole slew of changes designed to address many of these issues. But this is a complex game, where even small changes have unforseen ramifications, so it’s going to take time.
But they’ll get there 
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I watched the clip posted in this thread, to me it’s an aberration beserker/assault using AR and RC with Deceptor MG, where is the fun in that?
I don’t use Rally or Electric Reinforcement, period. AR I tested it and using it with 2nd class weapons/abilities is too much, so no more.
I can use Boom Blast or Rage Burst and that is as far I should go, Rapid clearance sometimes,
LV 6 and 7 abilities are so powerful for most of the classes and Multiclass enable lot of options, and perks.
On top of that Augmentations , bionic and mutations.
One approach, cooldown abilities, that actually could work for Hero or Legend levels, especially after mid game.
The other, some weapons are used only for the original class, if you want to use Deceptor with Berserker you can’t
or limiting the use, reducing effectiveness
the same for abilities with 2nd class soldiers, like AR , RC …
Which I have absolute faith of. They have Julian on board, with his experience from the original XCOMs which were fantastic (mostly).
And even from the initial release, this game just had that “something special” element about it, which is why I stuck around even though I was unhappy about the unfair difficulty. Thank fully that appears to have been resolved. So I’m happy.
I do look forward to experiencing the DLC related content, though I’d just like to beat the game once first without any of it. This game has required a level of organization that I’ve not had to do, since DOS gaming days (yep I’m that old :p), when you had to draw maps on paper. Maybe I just suck at the game, which is totally fair. Feel free to watch any of the videos of my play through that I’ve posted so far (in my thread New Playthrough Under Derleth) and tell me as such.
But I’ve been keeping notes on best gear to use per class, what squads I have etc etc. It’s like when I used to play tabletop gaming (Warhammer Fantasy and 40k).
The best part of the worst part of PP, is that allows different players different styles of playing.
There are the gung ho Rambo style players that want to blitzkrieg there way through every mission, damn the torpedoes - full steam ahead! For them the so called Terminal Build is their cake. Alas for them, they may not be able to eat their cake and have it too, as the game will no longer be a challenge. I may be wrong, but I think a lot of the call to nerf the TBs come from those that approach this style of up close and personal style of battle. For them the possibility of TBs ruins the game.
Then there are players that are just the opposite, the submarine sneak up and launch an attack unseen. The snipers first, then bring in the assault. The long range artillery first, snipers, then assault.
I tend to be one of the latter style of players. I don’t necessarily create TBs, but in the course of making builds for my play style they can exist. But, I don’t use them because that’s not my tactical method of playing. I tend to have a squad built of Assault/Sniper, Heavy/Sniper (to counter their accuracy) and Sniper/Heavy (because unlike @MichaelIgnotus I want Rage Burst for my Snipers).
When I build my units I work on upping their will power and strength prior to speed. So the last things my Assaults get are Dash, Rally the Troops and Rapid Clearance. Of the latter I only rely on Dash to get in an advantageous position or to get out of a bad one.
The Heavy becomes my long range artillery and spotter. While the Snipers try to take out long range targets that are the most threatening. Later on I fold in a Tech and Priest.
Because of my play style I am not prone to use most of the combos that are being stated as problematical.
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A lot of us have called for Cooldowns, but there seems to be some philosophical objection to it within the design team that I don’t quite understand (that is just my perception rather than anyone stating this).
I must admit, I’m against weapons limitations because it goes against the fundamental philosophy of the whole design, which I find really appealing. This game refuses to limit your options. Snipers don’t have to be Snipers, Heavies don’t have to carry Gatling-Guns. You can mix and match your builds to your heart’s content - and you can even overencumber your team if you want to. That’s great! And any attempt to shove that into a strait-jacket will ultimately damage the game imho.
That said, to misquote the greatest super-soldier of all time: “With great power comes great limitation.” The game ceases to work as a game unless you apply some limits somewhere. But I personally feel that those limits should come in the form of number of Skill uses per turn and/or Cooldowns, rather than arbitrary bans on using certain combos.
I also think that it should be up to each individual player to decide how (s)he wants to play the game. If you get your kicks building Terminators and wandering all over the map like the Death Cheat in Age of Empires, then more power to your elbow - just give me the option to play a properly balanced tactical game at the same time, please. 
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Cooldown would be my choice, too
Although I know that Devs will nerf some abilities like RB (5–>3), I don’t know if is intended for all dif. levels.
And anyway everything is fine to me, I can pick abilities to avoid or perks, or weapons, augmentations, tailoring the game to my style on my own.
But some missions need a rework, Bionic Fortress, Pandoran Palace, it’s too easy even without TB soldiers
And that’s great and I totally agree with your assessment.
But just because you don’t play with the TBs, and I don’t RB my Snipers, doesn’t mean those exploits aren’t still there and a game-breaking exploit of the game.
Ultimately, the devs will have to deal with this, unless they just want PP to be consigned to the ‘noble experiment’ Hall of Fame, rather than the classic it could become.
In the meantime, you and I will continue to play our own personal versions of this game, whilst resisting the urge to press the ‘get out of a jam free’ button that we know is there like the addicts we are.
"My name is Michael Ignotus, and I’m a TB addict. I’ve been clean for nigh on 6 months now - though there was that time when I needed to get the ODI down to buy time to finish the game and I mainlined 2 Lairs and a Citadel in one night. But other than that, I don’t do TB any more, honest…" (twitch, twitch)
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