Thoughts on the new Rage Burst, Mark for Death, & 'Onslaught'

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Actually, I find Legendary quite dull and restrictive (timer too short, Haven Recruits too similar to PP Recruits, not enough choice of Armours etc), so I choose to play on Hero.

I also choose not to build superheroes, and without superheroes I find the difficulty to be about right for my level of ability.

Of course, I could opt to build a Terminator, activate RC and stroll across the map annihilating all before me, but I self-restrict in a variety of ways and play HonestMan (which is essentially Ironman without the autosaves), and while that generally works for me, at times when things get hairy, it’s very difficult to resist the urge to press the ‘win game’ buttons and go into full superman mode.

But for me that’s simply not very interesting, which is why I’d like the devs to give me the option to turn it off. I’d much rather lose a favourite squaddie, but feel a sense of achievement about beating a mission where all but one of my squad got panic-locked or the squad got bombed to sh*! by Bombard Chirons, or half of them got MC’d by Sirens (all of which have happened), than engage an RC or AR loop and cheeze my way through the scenario.

But that’s just me. You have different goals and that’s fine. I don’t want to stop you having your fun, but similarly I’d still like the option to have mine and not constantly have to fight the urge to hit the ‘get out of jail free’ button.

All I’m saying is the only way the devs can give us both what we want, is either by making the game fully moddable, or by giving us Second Wave Options, where you can tick ‘Supermen On’ and I can tick ‘Supermen Off’ (though tbh it would be better if there was more granularity to it than that, like asking us how many times per turn we’d like RC to return APs or some such).

It’s on the cards, but not any time soon, as the devs have way too much on their plate atmo. But I can wait. :smirk:

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You should rather listen than criticize everything and everyone. There is (almost) no thread where your comment does not appear. It is not YOUR game and accept other opinions. It is not a chess world championship and there are several opinions regarding Nerfing and Supermen. Just let the people have their own say. Rude. I love Supermen.

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Do I really have to repeat this again?

I’m quite happy for you to have Supermen. In fact, I argue on the CC all the time that there are other people’s opinions out there which we have to take account of, who want something completely different to the game we would like - and that their wishes need to be accounted for.

But the only way that you can have Supermen and I can’t is by the devs giving us Second Wave Options, so that you get to turn Supermen ‘on’ and I get to turn Supermen ‘off’. Then everybody’s happy and we don’t have to keep on having these pointless circular arguments.

You instruct me to listen: how about you do the same? Please read the last 2 posts I posted on this thread - really read them, rather than reading the first few lines and immediately jumping to conclusions - and tell me where in those posts I said that you or anyone else for that matter shouldn’t be given the option to have Super Soldiers if you want them.

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You have said your opinion, all is well. We read it. Over and over again. Many people just want to enjoy the game with Supermen Build, if they want to. Do you understand that? Nobody wants to spend 30 days to grind a gun that can’t even shoot straight. Consider this. Simply listen.

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Sorry to jump in here, but that is really not fair.
@MichaelIgnotus is one that writes in almost any of his posts that every one should have the possibility to play the game as he like it. You really arguing with the false one here.

Some examples out of his last three posts in this thread:

And there are countless more from him and always with the same massage:
“Everyone should be able to play the game the way they like it best”

Additional options to make that possible not only for himself but also for YOU is his never ending fight.

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Yes I do. But you also need to understand that there are a similar number of people who feel that Supermen are breaking the game and want it fixed - and many of them are abandoning the game and/or posting bad reviews because of this.

As Mad Skunky has so kindly pointed out (thank you :blush:) I want both sides to enjoy this game and have spent nigh on 2 years now ceaselessly trying to find the middle ground that will enable you to enjoy the game you want while I and others get to enjoy the game we want.

I have long come to the conclusion that the only way that is possible is to do 2 things:

  1. Take account of other people’s wishes in the Difficulty Settings - so that Easy has things like Supermen turned ‘on’ and Reactive Evolution turned ‘off’ ; while Legend has it the other way around.

But that only half-fixes things. I, for instance, don’t enjoy Legend at all because I find it far too restrictive and uninteresting in terms of the game clock and recruitment.

  1. So ultimately, the only way that YOU can get to play how you like and I can get to play how I like is by giving us a series of Second Wave Options with tick-boxes (or better still sliders) that allow us to say: "I want to play with unlimited/limited Super-Soldier Skills and I want Reactive Evolution to happen fast/slowly/not at all.

The devs are listening. But it won’t happen soon. If it doesn’t happen, let’s hope the modding community will give each of us the fixes that we need, eh? :wink:

All I ask is that you don’t impose your vision of the game on me in the same way that I am trying very hard not to impose my vision of the game on you.

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67
  • Mark for death stack, if you have a lot of willpoints you can one shot almost anything. Which i foind invualuable to destroy enemy artillery or scillas, or sirens or umbra.
  • Onslaught, can be lifesaving, as you can give action points to any soldier in peril or to shoot another enemy.
  • Rage Burst, I agree, is a pointless skill most of the time.
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Thats a bug that reappeared and needs to be fixed to up to 1 mark of death per target. Current stacking and having multi super snipers enables you to after 3 plus stacks, kills with single low weapon.

It has proven invaluable only at Palace mission, where I find boss too passive as non-movable as well as his attack stupidly overpowered. Since there is no sign of this changing, heavy weapons close rage burts remain fastest kill way. However, yes, otherwise only close Scylla with mark of death remains other viable target in game. If there were some nearby stacked crowd of enemy in game, it would have more sense. Or more huge targets. In long distance war (like game seems to be built) its really mostly harmless as sooo unprecise …

P.S. Gotta love Corto, romantic and timeless black and white technique adventurer :slight_smile:

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Rage Burst works also fine with Chirons and you only need one Heavy when the Chiron is isolated (often in Lairs). First jump close and cast War Cry and in the following turn trigger Rage Burst with a Deceptor -> Chiron dead or close to dead and if not then War Cry again and kill him next turn.

It is also handy against Terror Sentinels when you can jump in and get an onslaught from an assisting Assault. Again, Deceptor is my weapon of choice for Rage Burst, any other was not that nice.

But I also find Rage Burst pretty useless against anything else. I tried it against a bunch of enemies at distance or Sirens, not really satisfying, grenades are often the better choice.

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Making Mark of Death not posible to stack, would make the skill useless imho.

There is a whole road from OP to useless, the dev solution to rage burst being OP was to make it pointless. I would hate seeing the same done to MoD.

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The actual problem of the current rage burst is that it SEEMS useless. It’s not well explained, it hangs in the name of the skill to explain it, but in previous versions the name did NOT have this role, as the skill worked in any situation, however ridiculous it became.

The current rage burst only works (very) well with BURST weapons and against big targets. This needs to either be better explained or to have limits in the skill, like being only usable by burst weapons. Problem is, it still works reasonably well with some non-burst weapons when you’re close enough.

So at the end we can see that the current skill implementation is just confusing.

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You mean in the current iteration, where it adds +50% damage after armor? Classes and Skills - wiki.phoenixpoint.com

Imho, if you get used to a skill that allows to do 500% damage on a target any time you want - just because-, anything less seems kinda pointless.

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No, if it stays in this version, all other skills would be useless.

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False, one skill being better than it should be does not make other skills less valuable. That is just a logical fallacy.

Also, i did not say keep it like it is. But keeping it as it is while removing the posibility to stack will make it a totally useless skill.

Wonder why no one here has even commented on this post on this skill? As it is, either you stack it to kill a single unit at the cost of most of your will points (which by the way it is only useful from time to time, will points are not cheap) or you dont use it. Also is not as OP as you imply unless you build your whole squad around it.

Quick aim is just a better trade of will points for damage for a sniper if you cannot stack MoD. Making the ability objectively useless compared to lower tier and cheaper abilities is not a good dev choice. That is the only thing im saying.

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In what universe is +50% damage after armor a useless skill?

MfD costs only WP, which are btw easily recoverable. Quick Aim costs WP, and you still need to shoot the weapon, which costs AP. This without getting into the maths of what has greater utility, a single shot or that any shots at the target deal +50% damage after armor (if the target has a lot of HP, probably the latter).

MfD with stacking is completely broken, allowing you to one-pistol shot anything in the game, including the final boss.

MfD without stacking is already borderline OP.

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No, at least not for me.
I use it only once on any target (because I assume it is a bug and don’t want to get used with the stacking) and it does a fantastic job by increasing almost any damage for 50% that comes in afterwards.

There is plenty of room between very strong and totally useless … :wink:

I need only one Sniper with full WP to kill a Scylla with this stacking behaviour, because the stacking is broken in it self (it doesn’t simply add).

Have a look:

A Sniper with the ancient Crystal Crossbow with 60 damage and 40 piercing, damage is doubled by Sneak Attack, so normal attack would deal 120 damage + 15% for the vivisection of the Siren, so 138 damage.
No MfD:

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1 MfD:

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2 MfD:

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3 MfD:

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4 MfD:

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5 MfD (all 20 WP used):

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If you still think this should be like it is now … I don’t know, I can kill a Scylla with only one Sniper and I don’t think something like this should be in the game, Sneak Attack is just weak compared to this.

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Last time i checked, +10 damage per bullet is not +50% damage. For most guns, you will get somewhere from +5% (useless) to +20% damage (useful sometimes, but as these are low damage guns not much, also still very far from what you get with quick aim.

In the end game you will be dealing with 500 health enemies + armor (small enemies) or 3k health enemies (big enemies), so most of the time +10 damage is useless. And much less effective than a 180 damage from an extra shot of a sniper rifle or heavy gun. Which is what you get with quick aim.

Again, I did not say leave it as is, i said is not as OP as many claim, and leaving as is without stack will make it useless. Also if the way stacks is broken, that is not a valid reason to just remove stack.

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Then you’re out of date :wink:

It was changed back to +50% after armor with the Polaris patch (v1.9).

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That’s why I asked if you were aware that the skill has been changed in Polaris, while its description stayed the same :slightly_smiling_face:

Check the link I posted previously:

http://wiki.phoenixpoint.com/Classes_and_Skills#Mark_for_Death

Edit:

Ninjaed :slight_smile:

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Just for anyone who thinks it should stay as it is, the same sniper but with the ancient sniper rifle, the Scorpion with normally 180 damage and 80 piercing with 5 times Marks for Death (all 20 WP used):

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Only one Sniper needed to kill the end boss …