Haven Defense suggestions

Note Seem to be stuck in early game do to the to many grenades problem the game currently have so no clue if the Haven defenses become more well varried with time.

Suggestions

  1. If a haven has a recruitment center the one you can recruit should pop up in the defense. They can level there but upon doing so the cost to hire them goes up as well.

  2. Haven’t should have 1 defender per 3 power on their end in the missions. The only exception are independent ones which should have small turrets dotted around the map.

  3. Civilians in defense should be proffecient with pistols, allowing you to arm them with pistols to defend themselves. (yes I know a player tag and join is being added, but they should be ok with at least one weapon type.)


The player should also be allowed to supply Haven’s with defenses like turrets and mines at later point to improve relations and increase their defense. Doing so should give a minor bit of resources on the haven defending its self with out you sending troops in. Though at the end of their defense you will need to re send any mines, and a chance of needing new turrets.


Note this comes from a person who is stuck in the early game do to grenade launchers breaking all my weapons to the point of can’t move on. Tried to cheese it with grenade launchers of my own. The damn AI can shoot targets it can’t see with accurate hits.

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I suppose that not all are military guys. In New Jericho you need to become soldier to be granted citizenship, but other factions are not so restricted and demanding for their followers. Remember there will be allied forces also defending haven when you will arrive.

Other ideas are ok, I think.

+1 If not pistols then melee, but they shouldn’t be defenceless. I feel that given the situation of the game world that anyone in it would have some basic ability to fight in order to defend themselves. If they didn’t know how to fire a gun at the start of the alien invasion, they’d quickly learn.

This is a really nice idea too, it lets you actively do some work to help havens to protect themselves. We’re trying to save all of humanity right? Why would we only do that by sending 6 guys around in a plane when we could actually give people the means to defend themselves?

Some are even born in havens and don’t know previous world, but as we saw in few of stories not all civilians are used to combat. They still want to live normal life, to cook and eat, to grow or produce something within safe walls of haven, to rise a child. Not all of them are guerilla comandos ready to kill some backon. :wink:

Exremely true, but reminder some places the moment things start going south like this even for the safer people start some basic training.

Though s brought up by well you in the first one It should be based on heaven.

The tech focused ones yeah no those guys should have unarmed and untrained people they are literally just trying to live life. So Ones that know how to defend themselves should be rare.

though for that I think there should be a perk for the standard soldiers "quick train." For 5 will and 3 action grant a civilian proficiency in pistols. Said civilian will retain pistol and proficiency in future haven defences if armed.

On the others New Jericho civilians should always be armed with at least a pistol a few with PDW’s they should be the easiest to defend and the least likely to need help.

The diciples I think as they are crazy cultists should have a few trained ones unlike the I forget their names the green ones they are more well open to the mutations. So We really should see some crazy things with them, like maybe rocking upto a defense and most the time tehy are all unarmed and unskilled but some times you see civilians armed with stolen alien weapons after beating one to death.

I didn’t say that they’d be used to combat. I said that they’d have a basic ability to fight in order to defend themselves. That’s a basic trait amongst humans. They’re not suddenly going to become guerrilla commandos, (though guerrilla commands often have a starting point of normal civilian life) but they will defend their child when that safety is threatened.

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You could also make it geographical, for example a haven based in N America might have a lot easier access to guns, whereas one based in Europe may access more melee weapons… though I’m not sure how easy that would be to program.

Problem with that is the start resets it will cause, people will reset the game over and over again to get into a start region that better fits their intro.

That said we already need a region start selection as it is some ways to start can actually cripple a game as is.

As for how hard it is to program, depends on how they go about it. Not a coder but one can easily tie stats to a location on the map similar to how they tie down the spawns for the alien bases.

Hi,

if we find ourselves in the same situation, we will defend our families instead of the invasion.
In every heaven, there must be some people who secure the place.

hi,

Sometimes we have no time to join an heaven defense, they should review the timing for that.
it’s frustrating, especially when the heaven is near.

Havens have some defence; expecially at the beginning you often see attack 7 defence 15 and you have to hurry to go there not to save the settlement but to find some alien to kill and get the reward

Speaking more in general i think that those settlements should have some organization with levy militia and/or professional guards; it’s an hostile environment and even if you are a farmer or a doctor you should be able to use a rifle, but dont ever think they could be comparable with your soldiers, elite troopers, the top of the crop of the army: SEALS, Spetznaz, SAS and similar very tough guys able to enter a base defended by levy troopers, do what they have to, and leave

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hi,

+1 I agree with you

Agreed. Geoscape would really benefit from mechanics that doesn’t involve tactical missions. Personally, I’d like to see Air Vehicles perform supply runs or other missions that takes time like scouting. This will also create a sense of choice on the geoscape: Do I use my aircraft to explore, reinforce or support?

Also, I don’t like the “one hit kill” of havens and alien lairs: They should only die when their population reach zero due to too many successful attacks (from PP, factions or aliens). Right now, both have really low complexity and investment worth: A failed defense in a haven and 4-5k people just die and one single successful attack on a lair and it dies (and get created again 5 mins later). There’s not much investment of time and planning into helping an haven or trying to knock down a lair at the moment.

Ok upgraded suggestion

HAVEN REWORK, defending.

Haven population is health: A havens health is not in its walls but its people. Keep them alive and the haven shall live.

With this, havens will only be destroyed if their population hits zero there are several ways this can happen.

  1. Haven attacks,

when a haven is attacked depending on the players actions or the defense level population can be lost. Example if The player helps and wins no population loss, if the player helps and looses -50 people per alien power. If the player doesn’t help -100 people per alien power. This means one must watch the attacks carefully. A single attack will no longer kill a haven.

  1. Immigration and Migration

If a haven is attacked multiple times a Migration event might happen. In these events the Population will pick a nearby haven or blank spot to move to.

These can be escorted by the player for rewards and faction cred. Escorts most of the time especially in early game have no hostile interactions. but when they do you are put in a long map, with 4 civilian vehicles that you have to escort to the other side. Hostiles are normally bandits and aliens.

  1. Infection

This is a timer on a haven, if a haven becomes infected there are few ways to deal with it, either the faction will come in and clean it out, or the player will this is a mission with human enemies. And chances for bad things to happen to your soldiers. The Disciples of Anu may not get infected.


with these The player has to worry a little less about havens. But with the new health mechanic would come a new defense mechanic.


DEFENSE

When a haven is attacked by default any recruit able soldiers (upto 4 per haven) will passively defend it, if the player joins the attack they will be spawned in a location protecting the objective or close to alien spawns engaged in combat.

In early game, the player has no control over these soldiers, in late game if allied with the haven they have direct control.

But what is a defense if its only defenders are guys with guns. Each faction and Project Phoenix have a way in which they can boost their defenses be it turrets, mines, repellers or what ever.

These are constructed per Haven with exception of Project Phoenix items which are airdropped and require the construction of a Cargo transport which can not hold troops but can hold supplies. though smaller ones like mines can be supplies via the troop transport.

Example of haven defense supplies Project Phoenix can build.


Light Turret
info: standard AR turret
defense: +1 (max 4)
combat map: upto 4 spawn when enter combat always on high ground.
lasts: 1-4 passive, depends on if destroyed active.
transport: troop, cargo

Frag mine
info: explodes for 50 damage double damage to legs.
defense: +0.5 (max 20 mines)
lasts: 1 is destroyed per power level of aliens reduces attack power before the attack. (so if an attack comes in with 5 power and you have 4 mines on the haven it has 1 power. cuts a max of 20)
transport: troop, cargo(bulk)
bulk: a box containing 10 mines good for max supplying multiple havens in a row.

AT MINE
info: explodes only on contact with large targets (2x2+) dealing 100 damage double per legs/wheels
defense: 1 (max 4)
lasts: similar to mines, reduces incoming power of attacks, though reduces by 4 per mine. And only does so if the attack is marked to have a large creature.
transport: troop, cargo(bulk)
bulk: a box of 4 AT mines.

emplacement Turret
info: a heavy turret with a 20mm autocannon and 2 shots of a guided Javelin style missile launcher
defense: +15 (max 1 per district on haven)
lasts: permanent though may require repairs.
transport: Cargo

Weapon supply crate
info: a crate containing 6 pistols, and 24 mags. any active defense will start with 6 armed civilians.
defense: +4
lasts: permanent
transport: cargo.

Faction ones

manned machine gun nest
faction: New Jericho
info: A manned turret, so long as a person is standing on the squire behind it, they have a 1 action assault rifle attack/ holds 20 attacks worth of ammo.
note: the machine gun its self can be given to a soldier acting as a heavy weapon until deployed.
defense: +4 (max 1 per district, can not have with phoenix emplacement turret)
lasts: permanent
as weapon: can be equipped as a weapon and mounted to low cover. Can un deploy it but can not keep if taken in defensive mission. Will always have a soldier manning it in defense.

Incinerator turret
Faction: New Jericho
info: an automated turret armed with a flamethrower and twin napalm rockets
note: like all heavy turrets one per district can not have with another heavy turret.
defense: +10
lasts: permanent

light drone district
Faction: Synedrion
Info: One of only two area of effect defenses, any havens in X range will get 2 flying drones on all active defenses and +2 to their defense. The drones themselves are pretty weak in combat but they do drop laser pistol ammo.
defense: +4 own, +2 to all havens in range.

Heavy drone district
Faction: Synedrion
Info: an upgrade of above, replaces the drones with a heavier model armed with a sniper like laser and 2 grenades. has a slightly longer service range.
defense: +8 to own, +4 to havens in range.

Calming tower
faction: Disciples of Anu
info: a large tower one per haven. When placed reduces accuracy of all aliens in active missions effectively reduces alien power by 3 in passive.
defense: +2
lasts: three haven defenses active or passive. (aliens target it.)


Most will likely note I put a defense number to all ideas in this. These numbers are mostly meaningless but give a player a good view of how prepaired a haven is for an attack. The higher the number the lower the chance the player will need to enter the attack. As some items don’t effect the direct battle like mines. It is important to know what the overall defense of the haven is at.

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@warbrand2 I love your ideas! I for one would love a more dynamic haven defence mission, with varying consequences. I’ve always thought that at least with a base destruction there should also be mass migration to the nearest haven. There’s no way that so many people get completely wiped out.

I’d also like to see their fellow faction havens assist - they have aircraft of thier own after all.

You could also flip that on it’s head, and if your relationship with a faction was high enough, find that they send troops to help you defend your own base(s) when attacked.

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Yeah that would be epic, high relations and getting curb stomped in a defense suddenly an ally appears to help.

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Wonder if I should expand on the ideas I have for Haven supply drops. Things like food resource drops which can help a struggling haven.

Though that might be a haven request thing. They may request supplies to X haven or mention a problem that is not urgent the player can take on. only reward is minor or weapons/gear looted but gives good bonuses to the havens view on you.

Did anyone already tried to protect faction havens FROM EACH OTHER? These morrons start their civil war surrounded by bloody mist and dying humanity. My soldiers are exhausted by killing humans and have no rest, to protect them from aliens! Please, just give me a diplomatic mission to keep them in peace, and a way to donate materials for upgrade defence of mostly damaged havens. Thats all what I ask now.

I stood back while Jericho wiped out Anu because, well, the Disciples are a bit creepy. But when they turned on Synderon I stepped in and kicked some Jericho butt.

Bit weird how, if the attackers win, they wipe out every man, woman, and child…