Think combos are OP, don't use them

  • quick / temporary solution
    3AP overwatch(auto trigger on enemy turn) for 3 bursts with -50% acc
    (3 bursts are enough for 1 target, little controlled damage for SR)
  • skill for swipe
    to develop mechanics in which the overwatch cone will be a horizontal line of defeat, and the muzzle movement “to the left and to the right” according to the rng.
    3AP “overwatch” for 5 bursts with -50% acc

This Forum, Canny, Community Council?
If Modders were officially on this forum, that would be exactly the case.
But I didn’t mean game with current skills.

No, thinking that the game cannot be balanced without modders would be absurd. It would be like giving up let the community fix it. I’m just making sure I don’t misunderstand your quote.

Obviously, neither the Forum, Canny or the Community Council are absurd. What would be is if you’d need to download a bunch of mods over at nexusmods to have a balanced experience.

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If you want to argue with me regarding mods for PP, argue after starting Modding Tools.

Possibly a language barrier. I am at a loss how to even respond to this.

In its idea and implementation, a mod is a rebalancing of an original game.

I know what a mod is. (By the way, they cannot only rebalance). I’m still not sure what me making a mod has to do with continuing this conversation with you.

My original post simply boils down to:
Do you think this game can only be balanced by modders ?

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Not necessarily true. Some mods unbalance games to suit players that feel some things are just too hard and want to tilt the balance to their side.

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If Johnny Lampkin & Co. (LW1,2) agreed, then definitely Yes, for Me.

Exactly this

Johnny Lump took years to make that full conversion mod. Vanilla Xcom was already a very solid and challenging base for quite some time.

I do not get your point.

Relying on modders to come up with something like long war would be a dead sentence. This game has not nearly enough momentum for such sophisticated modding to occur.

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We have no vivid examples.

I give up. I guess you win, with whatever opinion you have. (I’m still not sure what it is exactly)

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Everyone who waits for Modding has long lost, there are just little illusions.

Easier said than done, truly.

First time through, you’ll assume it’s balanced… then realize after playing for hours you’ve grown to a point where you’re unexpectedly more powerful than you’d like.

Now you have to spend many MORE hours, finding out a nice balance that you can enjoy.

THEN, you can enjoy… only to realize, it’s not really as balanced as you thought it might be, so now you have to adjust more.

THEN… repeat. Maybe after dozens of hours you’ll find a good balance you like… but it’s hard to not look back and feel “Why the hell am I being forced to do this? Isn’t this a Developer’s/Playtester’s job?”

Edit: Shoot… I should’ve just read VOLAND’s post a few down from the OP… literally said the same thing but better. A lot of people share this sentiment apparently. I’ve been hasty.

But I’ll now also add that one of my big issues here with Phoenix Point is that there are 4 difficulty levels that barely show any differences. The game is quite clearly in a state of development that resembles an Early Access game and is not advertised as one. The developers are rapidly (that might be a stretch, more rapid would be preferably ironically) changing things like it’s a MOBA. We’re quite clearly unpaid workers at this point playing a fairly incomplete game.

Are there good things about PP? Absolutely. It certainly stands out from the rest of the pack in the genre in quite a few ways, both positive and negative. If it were labelled Early Access, I’d agree with OP more to lighten up on things… but with the history of how this game’s been made, marketed and sold… The frustration is more than justified.

Personally I’ve outright stopped playing PP, but I never bought it to begin with. I buy games I think are worth buying, and I was playing it on Gamepass. I’ve now moved on to other games on Gamepass, but even they present these same problems. Been playing NMS for 30hrs just trying to figure out restrictions and rules just to make the game enjoyable, and it is becoming enjoyable. I did the same thing with PP before just finally giving up as the game never really did get enjoyable enough, and the sound effects in PP really began to annoy me. You must try to understand that the process of making a game enjoyable, isn’t entirely enjoyable in itself and if that’s all you end up feeling like you’re doing then I think it’s fair to be upset about that, especially if you paid money. Now in NMS’s defense, that game is a pseudo-mmo/sandbox that I’m trying to turn into a survival game, so that one’s on me. PP however is a tactical/strategy game that I was trying to turn into a tactical/strategy game.

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I like to think of it as Epic funded Early Acces.

finances can be quickly drained, as well as time.

Actually, I think you made the point very well.

What a lot of people don’t get is just how invested you need to be in this game to figure out how not to use the broken skill combos - and often those broken combos have put people off the game before they’ve had time to get that invested.

A good game takes time to balance. See XCOm and all the others. No game was perfect from the beginning, I would say that there is no game that satisfies you to write nonsense. Just don’t use the skills you think are OP, done. It didn’t take me a second to figure out how I wanted to play the game. Hardcore players like you shouldn’t have a problem. Just don’t use it, like the speaker said.

You are free to choose how you build your game. The game is not a one-way street that leads you. No personal offense.

None taken, but I still think @Rainer made his point very well. And I know from the questions they keep asking us that the devs value feedback from the players about how the game is working for them.