So there’s no risk to do that? Yes we don’t play the same game.
This is cool! But how do you deal with Return Fire from Arthrons?
Shoot the arm off, I would imagine. It has thin armor and few HPs.
IMO, there is an obvious issue with quick aim and weapons that cost 1AP, as it violates the “Law of No Damage Without AP Cost During the Player’s Turn”
Lately I have been thinking about these “laws” that could be used to govern the anarchy of the skill sandbox, without going into the one use per turn limitation.
The question is: can you do it reliably with just one burst from PDW?
Likely “yes” at point blank, but we are speaking about replacing AR, so there is probably medium distance, and don’t forget -20% aim from Reckless perk.
I think as reliably as with non-laser AR, depending on the accuracy buffs.
In my experience ARs are not accurate enough to hit specific body parts. I almost exclusively use Sniper Rifles or shotguns (point blank) for that purpose.
That is normally the case, until you start stacking accuracy buffs on top of each other and then both the AR and the laser PDW can do it with a similar degree of reliability.
The thing is, as @jj482b says - or I think he does, sorry if I’m misinterpreting - the PDW and the AR are both similar in accuracy and damage, except the PDW costs 1 AP to fire, which means that with quick aim it can be fired for 0AP. And then you can build the soldier with enough WPs and speed and give him gear that boosts his accuracy - the point is that a marginal increase in accuracy with the AR can’t compete with the low AP cost of the PDW.
That’s why I think that quick aim shouldn’t reduce the cost of firing a weapon lower than 1AP.
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Perhaps… however I like it that Snipers have free Overwatch with 1 AP weapons! 
Me too, and I don’t see a problem with that, same as with Return Fire, because it can’t be used during the player’s turn.
in that particular case, they were Melee Arthrons with shield. so i didnt had to worry about return fire, anyway even with machineguns, i would aim for arms as those usually cant survive a burst…
Pistol zero cost overwatch is boredom repetitive, even let’s plays suffer heavily from it.
There’s a decision aspect, but it’s not worth the awful repetitive aspect. Should be forbidden. But I don’t see the problem with PDW or Pistol and Quick Aim, there’s a cost of will and that’s it. Eventually the piercing PDW is too powerful and this is the problem to fix, other PDW and Pistols will never do miracles so it’s not a general problem.
Using pistol for zero cost overwatch means that you’ll also return fire with it instead of sniper rifle (if Assault/Sniper, which is common until you can make Infiltrator/Snipers). Unless you really need to finish some low hp straggler with overwatch, switching to pistol is not helpful.
Overwatch isn’t big in PP as whole - it’s much more reliable to clear the board on your turn. Anything other than sniper rifle firing center-mass from afar isn’t going to do much to armored enemies (which is all of them) anyway.
Precisely. I think its something Developers didnt consider when they created this game… way too many things are focusing on damage over turn, but then Aliens have extremely high damage potential, and can kill you in single shot… which means using anything that doesnt outright kill enemy is waste of AP and Will points… it forces player to focus on those special quick killing builds to clean the map of potential danger as soon as possible…
and nerfing player ability to kill will just frustrate player more… you cannot force player to use something that is not effective the way you make things that are effective to not work anymore… thats not how balancing should look like… Player needs to have more options how to solve situation, not less…
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Actually, I think there are a few more layers to the game than alpha striking. What PP penalizes is a passive gameplay style - just putting your guys & gals behind cover in sight of Pandas and giving them overwatch, as you would in F XCom, doesn’t work at all. But you can play active defense - there are things like decoy, electric armor, fire, spiders, and return fire and overwatch can be quite effective if used right.
There is definitely balancing and difficulty issues to address, but I don’t think alpha striking is the only way to go. Most of the issues I see have to do with exploitive combinations, which IMO appear when skills allow 1) to do damage during the player’s turn at 0 AP cost, 2) to refund unlimited or very large numbers of APs (rally the troops, rapid clearance), 3) to stack unlimited buffs to stats/damage (100% stealth, damage buffs of multiple third row skills + stealth x2 buff, electric armor x2, etc.)
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its not the only way to go, but its the only safe way how to deal with enemy. which is a shame. Those abilities that work over longer time are just not penalizing enough to be even considered… why would you even bother with poison or fire, when there are other weapons that kill enemy instantly…
I meant fire as active defense tool, not for the damage over time it deals over time. But yes, you are right, alpha striking is the safest choice. My point is that it is so in large part because of OP combinations that allow to reliably do massive amounts of damage in a single turn. Without these absurdly OP combos the gameplay is more interesting.
Exactly! Also don’t forget disables like War Cry, Stun, Panic and Mind Control. And you can also disable weapons. I would also like to bee able to use goo against Pandorans. Or to greatly reduce their accuracy. Or to remotely detonate their explosive ammo,
i dont think its because of player ability to do such things… player is just searching for most efficient way so he combines best abilities to be able to cope with the AI side… AI is sometimes just way too strong to be dealt any other way… If AI can kill you instantly with single hit, you will look for ways how to kill it before it can do it to yourself… its typical law of action and reaction… so i think main issue is Alien being way too strong in certain situations
This, IMO, is the issue. Take away the absurdly OP combinations and the players will find other ways to deal with most situations. Adjust the difficulty and the absurdly OP combinations will still be there and they will still be the most efficient way of playing.
I’m not saying that difficulty doesn’t need to be fixed - it does, just that it shouldn’t be used as an excuse for the exploits.
Movement range is usually too big to defend effectively. And anyway, they’ll ignore your overwatch and accept the hit but you will take a grenade in return. It took me 4 AR overwatches on a crab to take it down and they weren’t even far from it.