Are you kidding me? Like send keys to the game to streamers. How hard this is? and can make you a millons of revenue. And you don’t do that because what? Even if you don’t have any money you can promote your game as a developer or studio. You’re making this stuff not for yourself but to sell it to players. So how the heck you don’t promote it later?
And one can argue you may not actually need to promote a DLC, as the potential customers are the people who owns the game and will or have been notified of this upcoming DLC.
Yeah. And owners can get notified that the world doesn’t work that way. But it looks like they don’t read any forums or messages to know that. Maybe they have mindfraggers on. They promoted the game more when it was bugged like hell. And now when it’s actually more finished nobody is doing anything. This is stupid. Maybe that’s why SnapShot was sold in the end. They can get stuff done but are lacking in marketing or other areas. But it doesn’t look like the change of the owner has changed anything in that departement. If what you say is true then it got actually worse.
I’m not kidding you, I said there may be no one being paid to promote the DLC. So unless you can point to someone being in charge of the promotion, it is indeed a possibility. And indeed it is common for small studios to not have PR at all.
Also, as far as I know it is not a common practice to send 8$ DLC keys to streamers before launch. Or maybe they have actually done it and the videos are not there yet. Or maybe high profile youtubers are not that interested on reporting on a DLC of a non AAA company for a non controversial game that is no hot news…
“world doesn’t work that way”. But It does. There is a section that shows me when I game I have interest in or I own has received an update in steam.
The point is you are holding PP to a standard similar companies and Games usually don’t follow. So the point you are making does not seem to me as obvious as you think it is.
I think you are carrying assuptions that you have no way of knowing if are true or not. And you are kind of having a confirmation Bias here; can you point out to the promotion material of similar priced DLC on similar sized games and show it is the rule rather than the exception?
Okay. I know that. I was rather saying that normally that works if you have established brand. For small product you need to promote stuff. And even for established brands you need to work hard to sell it. This is why sales guys earn more that the ones that build stuff. Because even if you build some exceptional stuff but sold nothing, then you still have nothing. And on otherhand if you have built some shit and sold it then you still sold at least something.
Also, as far as I know it is not a common practice to send 8$ DLC keys to streamers before launch. Or maybe they have actually done it and the videos are not there yet. Or maybe high profile youtubers are not that interested on reporting on a DLC of a non AAA company for a non controversial game that is no hot news…
But we’re talking about promoting a game that possibly nobody promotes. If that’s true then you send those keys to streamers and give them commision for selling your game. Isn’t it better than doing nothing?
Personally I don’t think paid promotion is a or percentage of sales is so clearly a good thing to do. Many people despise and heavily criticizes paid promotion
Yeah I agree, although this depends on how you do this. Because it can actually work. You can argue even that giving a free key is some sort of paid promotion. And this is common on twitch.
What is clear seeing the twitch stream, and that only one person was doing it, Snapshot_EE, who as far as I know has been completely overloaded with work for the last couple of months. I think it is quite clear that they don’t have much money for PR, and probably they have 0 funds for promotion.
Also again, sending DLC keys to youtubers is not even a common practise.
Yeah. I’ve catched that one. I just don’t understand how you think this is promoting anything. Like don’t you need somoene to watch the stream to actually do something with it?
I think you were expecing a AAA promotional stream with different devs discussing, a host, a live studio or professional equipment. This may be telling if only, that this is the promotion they can afford to do and the size of the studio PP has. And as so, expecting a promotional campaign is an unrealistic expectation. Which was my point in the first place.
I think you were expecing a AAA promotional stream with different devs discussing
No. But it’s silly trying to promote only yourself by twitch youtube channel if you don’t have any of it. And you don’t actually have a channel to begin with.
Also again, sending DLC keys to youtubers is not even a common practise.
Depends how big youtubers / stremears you’re talking about. For big streamers youtubers this is more common. If you have over 1000 viewers daily you can get much of the stuff for free if you show it.
Like think of it. You send some 40$ game to one guy. And 10.000 people see it. Even if only one person buys it you’re even or actually you’re in the green. because sending game to streamers costs nothing.
And maybe sending is not optimal. But the problem was that they don’t have any money. So what do you do when you don’t have money? you send the keys…
And you send a 8$ DLC to one guy and 10.000 people see it? I dont know, and that is the point.
It it reasonable to assume the have been using the 100% of their resources in developement, and promotion has not been invested in, or planed, or performed. As simple as that.
You have a very strong opinion for them using streamers to promote the DLC, I dont think is so easy as you imply and again, a promotion campain requires time and resources. Time and resources I dont think they have. So AFAIC they are putting the money and the work where the money and the work should be.
I think they will upload the video to youtube, and that is where the promotion will end. Which again, is not disimilar to what many big dev companies do to promote DLCs.
you’re making this more complicated like it is. they don’t need any AAA streams, equipment or PR department. They don’t need any money in fact to do this. They just need to think how to cooperate with streamers and youtubers and players. And this cooperation part is mostly lacking.
Time and resources I dont think they have.
I will tell you a little secret. They will never have resources. Because if you allocate resources where they don’t pay off you always have no resources. Because as soon as you have them you allocate them wrongly.
You have a very strong opinion for them using streamers to promote the DLC,
No. But this is what you do when yo don’t have any money. It’s like me telling them to change sth in code before. And they responded nope this can’t be done because it’s build that way. This is the same with “they don’t have any money, so they can’t promote”. They’re constricted to choices that cost minimal amount of money. Cooperating with streamers and youtubers is one of those choices.
And promoting stuff through their own channel isn’t an option here because they don’t have any reasonable reach to do anything. They’re just wasting their time doing it. Or resources. Like instead of this guy wasting his time doing theses streams, let him send those keys to streamers and convice some people who’re doing streams as a job / hobby daily to do this stuff for him. One searching guy can find dozens of streamers to stream the game. But one streamer can only stream one at the time to one audience. In this case very limited audience looking at this stream you’ve sent me. This is how the youtube / twitch math promotion work. You don’t stream your game. You find people who stream it for you.
Just for the record, this is what has been done for promote the DLC.
Advertisement and announcements in the web.
Advertisement and announcements on the forums and discord.
Advertisements and announcements on twitter and facebook
Advertisements and announcements on steam.
Youtube trailer (4 hours ago).
Twitch stream (3 hours ago).
… The stuff we don’t know about
I don’t know why you keep making such a big deal of streamers. It is not that common for DLCs to have those kind of campaigns before launch even in bigger studios. So they probably have not done it… so what?. Is ok if you think they should have advertised the DLC more. But I dont think your expectations are realistic or the magnitude of your criticism warranted.
I know this can be received as a critique but I’m not upset or anything. I just point out what works and what doesn’t and what objective results we have.
I don’t know most of the stuff: what was done and how results look like, so I’m only speculating here.
If they’re looking at results of those actions you’ve listed and those results look good then great. Nothing to worry about. But I see on this forum too many excuses they don’t have this they don’t have that, they can’t change this, they can’t change that. At the same time nobody asking actually how do we do this?
I don’t know if it is working. That is a claim you cannot make if you don’t have the DLC sale numbers.
All you know is the game is not as popular as you think it should be. Which is also a subjective claim. And I think you are being biased, harsh and hostile in your claims about the devs.
Is that something you do whenever you buy a Book or a ticket for a movie or a show you don’t like? Because I am simply having difficulties understanding what is your point now.
I’m quite sure they are much more interested than you on their work being a success. If their work does not pay off it will be more than anyone else’s, their loss. And I’m sure they are doing their best to make it right. You disagree? Ok, but what is your point and why do you think you are entitled to criticize them on those terms?
hah. I suppose that youtubers are checking DLC right now, and if they will find that it is worth some more time (PP campaign is long) then they will stream/upload. It all depends on the reception of the DLC of such individuals. I doubt that Snapshot will pay for getting prime time on their channels, so if they already play other games then Phoenix Point will probably wait a while. Phoenix Point is not the AAA title in the end, so with exception of some enthusiasts of this genre it can be hard to obtain youtubers interest. Good day/night to you people.
You need to have a good game and good DLC’s to get something from those streamers…
PP is a tactical game for casuals who does not like challenges but TBS games are mostly tactical and hard… So a TBS game streamers would not like that and a random one would not get it at limited time.
As PP got great base game mechanics but mostly half-baked content and very unbalanced powerplay with lower then average DLC’s without mod support, there is nothing to show off rather then some cool trailers.
Good day/night to you people.
but yes he sounds harsh… I got used to that.