Lairs are a boresome slog, needs reinforcements either removed or curbed

Jetpack should help, very fast units can work. Snipers can find a hole but it’s less safe.

For Chiron, it’s tedious RNG instakill, bad design if you ask me, no link with any mission, Chiron need a deep design change.

I’m working on a lair right now where my squad is being rushed by six sirens at the same time. Not fun.

I hate them. I have restarted, saved, run out of ammo, had 3 sets of screamers right at the spawn point and seemly endless Sirens. Ugh I hate them. And I hate that we have no way to break the mind control accept to kill them. Then I have how many more of them to deal with? Yes a complete drudgery. After I killed so many, they just still kept coming. Was thinking, oh I cant have many more and then I can move forward, nope. Just ran out of ammo and got mind controled.
We can mind control but it only lasts a couple of turns. They mind control and you can control them back, but it doesnt break the mind control on your soldier. I thought stunning it would, but no. Your just stuck till you kill them while 3 or 4 more of them are slithering closer so you can do it all over again. So how can I capture one if incapacitating it doesnt break the control on my guy. I tried twice and got out and did something else. But I can see from what you guys are saying, its pretty much the same and really really needs work. I thought after killing so many I would at least have level ups, but I didnt. So probably go back to Xcom till all these things actually become playable so you can finish the game. Then for me, all the freezing and having to save, save and restart and save and hang and restart. Gets tiring. We need tools to fight deal with the mind control and many other things that have already been said. At least in Xcom you have tools to deal with things if you are clever and figure things out. Hope this gets straigtened out, I was so looking forward to this.


Having to escape from nests could be interesting. Especially if you cheesed your way in, but then are left lacking in willpower and still needing to find a way out past all those incoming reinforcements. You might just have sent that 1 jet-packing heavy to their doom. :wink:

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Exactly: I came back a week later to see if anything has changed, nope it’s only more complaints. Game needs a few more months of development, for real.


Did a lair yesterday and it took me 2.5 hours to finish it (with me taking a break to say WTF lots of times and think how to get out of it alive).
Everything was rolling until I hit a choke-point where there was a Siren. Any troop that would go through there and she would scream (-10WP) and panic them (and the fireworm Chiron shooting at us). My heavy was panicked so no grenades or rockets to make it pay. Assaults were too close so no dash and quick aim to dispose of it. Then a second Siren comes. The biggest problem was the impossibility to have line of sight on them with my snipers.

I concentrated on killing the other aliens with my snipers until the Sirens had no more WP to scream. And once I could go and kill them, 2 more Sirens show up (but this time I could rage burst them into hell). Oh, and after that 2 more (I think they spawned).

I had to use all the tricks I could to get out of this: war cry, rally troops, rage burst, dash, quick aim, (bash on fireworms). I even did a rage burst with the pistol because my sniper had to climb to get line of sight to remove a threat that was going to kill one of my other troops.

Situation was so desperate at times. I feel a sense of accomplishment for having gone through this without a KIA and no save-scumming (had forgot to make a save and wanted to see how badly I would lose).

But … I’m really used to those kind of games and I play on the lowest difficulty. How do you expect a real newbie to get out of this ???


I have a quick and dirty solution to lairs - get a berserker (from the anu faction), level him up to 7 (6 is mandatory). Pick the passive that makes him immune to mind control, and dual spec with assault for Dash. Equip him with a shotgun.

It’s actually really easy to solo the lair like this since the worm is always in the top left just run over there. Use dash early because those dancing poles will suck your will away anyways. Shotgun to the face bam finished.

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I played this game 10h and quit because nothing had amazed or thrilled me once. Never got to these lairs either. But reading all these weird unrealistic strategies to win this game certainly is funny as hell and much more enjoying than the game itself


The mission I was talking about had 3 places where the target could be. And of course it was the last one that was the right one. The problem in the mission was going through the choke-point with the Sirens removing my soldier’s will.
At least now I know that if there is a choke-point, I dig a hole in a wall with my hell-cannon to give myself some other options.

I find it interesting that at no point did you mention explosives or trying to blind fire area AoE explosives through the chokepoint to where you knew the Siren was.

If you know the rough location of something, a heavy with a grenade launcher doesn’t actually need LoS due to how the grenade launcher arc and fire distance works. It is inaccurate and may take more than one blind fire attempt, but that’s how I typically get around similar scenarios.

In fact the sheer number of posts I see where it seems everyone is mostly just running around with snipers, infiltrators and some token assault units and think all heavies are for are jetpack cheese… are people really not using the miracle that is blind firing into locations without needing clear LoS in order to hit things? As I have lost count on the number of times that blind firing at a location I know a enemy is at but don’t have clear LoS has saved my ass and turned a potentially dangerous threat into nothing but a bug splat on the floor.

This isn’t Back Build 5 anymore where one or two snipers can solo win every mission, fortunately it seems Snapshot did some tuning to account for that though it’s still not quite perfect coughinfiltratorscough. :stuck_out_tongue:

You assume too much.

I knew the Siren was there once it screamed. Had no line of sight on this place before, so couldn’t see it. The choke-point was some kind of elevated platform. You can go there with a ladder and fall on the other side. Siren was placed behind the platform completely hidden until I eared the noise of it moving … too late.

Heavy and 2 assaults (front line) got panicked, so no explosives to throw at it. And it is written in my post (at least for the heavy) so don’t know how you missed it. Also two snipers were in range but they had enough WP to not panic.

A Siren scream is -10WP, so if you just used powers like jetpack, dash or quick aim, you can quickly be panicked if one shows up round the corner.

Since the Siren was only screaming to make them sitting ducks on the platform (and AI stupid enough to make one of them move out of cover into the open), I used my snipers to remove all other baddies (fortunately not hidden by the platform) that could potentially shoot them (including a pistol rage burst on a Triton). Once they got free from panic I did nuke the place.

The spawnery is not always in the top left. I just finished a lair where the spawnery was top right.

Should still be doable even in the top right. You’re moving much faster than the enemy is and you only need 1 or 2 turns with the hatch to blow it up.

The point is that you don’t know where it is. If you commit to a corner and are wrong, you’re screwed.

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No like I said you’re not screwed, you still have time to move to the other side and kill it before they kill you.

(also, as a minor point that is not to be misconstrued as the main point stated above, you can always save scum since the map layout doesn’t change once you’re inside)

If you burn a bunch of WP rushing to the wrong corner, you’ll likely not make it to the other one, as the sirens will be already be converging on you and you’ll be under the fire of two Chirons

I’ll stick to a more methodical approach.

I agree, I hate lairs more than anything in this game. It’s boring, the layout is confusing, it takes forever unless you do some cheesy stuff and the reinforcements just makes it take even longer.

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Yep, my bad. I missed that part of your post, apologies about that.

There’s a perfectly easy solution to the “wrong corner” problem. Bring two Assaults. I usually have three. (One pure, one Asssult/Heavy and one Asssult/Berzerker). Any of them can reach the Spawnery in one turn when frenzied. Usually with 4AP left, but if not the Spawnery is dead on the second turn, no biggie.

When it comes down to it, I’d rather save scum and use conventional tactics than use magic power exploits. No judgement, just personal preference.