# Arthrons reaction fire **URL:** \ **Category:** Hints and Tips\ **Created:** [January 29, 2020, 9:27pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169 "2020-01-29T21:27:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![LouisdeFuines](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/louisdefuines/32/2605_2.png) [@LouisdeFuines](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/LouisdeFuines)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 9:27pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/1 "2020-01-29T21:27:47Z")
Is there a way to not trigger it? What sense does it make to shot at them, if they immediately shoot back and deal the same damage to you? ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 9:36pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/2 "2020-01-29T21:36:39Z")
They won’t do it if they don’t have good line of sight on you (I.E. shooting them through a gap in a tree or at a good angle behind a wall or something) but that’s obviously quite situational. Most relaible method is to snipe their gun arm off before attacking them from close-mid range. Careful with the inidicator icon though; pretty sure it’s bugged as I and others have been RF’d by Arthurs without indication, so for now (patch due tomorrow so hopefully this will soon be outdated information) just eyeball it lol. ---
**Author:** ![LouisdeFuines](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/louisdefuines/32/2605_2.png) [@LouisdeFuines](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/LouisdeFuines)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 9:37pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/3 "2020-01-29T21:37:58Z")
Is there any site I can see the patchnotes of former Patches und future ones? And how do you know, there will be a patch out tomorrow? ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 9:39pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/4 "2020-01-29T21:39:33Z")
Yup! Try [https://forums.snapshotgames.com/](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/) 😉 [I gotchu tho fam.](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/patch-notes-dunwich-16-01-2020/8858/3) Patchnotes for Miskatonic will also be posted here I would imagine. ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 9:41pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/5 "2020-01-29T21:41:32Z")
> [@LouisdeFuines](#): > > And how do you know, there will be a patch out tomorrow? [Good ol’ UV.](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/dlc-has-been-delayed/9152/4) ---
**Author:** ![Zzzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f0a364/32.png) [@Zzzz](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Zzzz)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2020, 7:52pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/6 "2020-01-30T19:52:49Z")
> [@Lunazathoth](#): > > They won’t do it if they don’t have good line of sight on you (I.E. shooting them through a gap in a tree or at a good angle behind a wall or something) but that’s obviously quite situational It’s not that situational when you start try exploit it. It requires some good sense/understanding of los, and obviously first time was more random and you hadn’t anticipated it. But with experience/practice it’s a tool that can be used more and more often, even if not that often. > [@LouisdeFuines](#): > > Is there a way to not trigger it? > > What sense does it make to shot at them, if they immediately shoot back and deal the same damage to you? Here some suggestions from another thread: > [@\[Feedback\]\[Spoiler\] Goodbye Phoenix Point](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/feedback-spoiler-goodbye-phoenix-point/9109/2): > > I wanted open a thread on tools against RF, common who didn’t screwed up because of RF? 🙂 > > Here a first draft: > > - Longer range, even this has traps with crabs having a rather long range. A bit basic, and not always possible. > - Owerwatch, not perfect and there’s a part of anticipation that can go wrong, plus it can go weird if the crab can move and totally ignore your cover. Still if not, at least you’ll get shoot at with a cover stopping some bullets. if you try shoot from this cover, the RF will be against a soldier with no cover. Morever if the soldier has RF you get two shoot at alien against only one shoot from enemy. > - Control/shoot/uncontrol, but for sure now it cost an AP it’s more for some special cases. > - Destroy weapon, well if you fail the destruction you’ll cry. In fact it’s easier for a sniper, but then the range disable RF, it is more a strategic approach, disarm two crabs more than kill only one. > - Blocked los from enemy to you, the good point of RF is there isn’t a side step, so sometime you can shoot at, and RF won’t be possible. > - Sonic grenade, it’s not cheap but it’s a way. > - Invisibility (Vanish), that’s a way. > - Stealth not detected, harder or less use case but no will cost. > - Electric Reinforcement, I know it looks basic, but to open a chain of attacks against RF aliens, why not? > - Stun, typically with the cannon, but I’m not sure when stun fail, perhaps sometimes because of shield when they become stronger. > - Alien with overwatch, then no RF until the overwatch is applied. Use cases without breaking the overwatch are rare, the lotery win is get the overwatch then the RF, ok I don’t know if it’s possible to endure both, anyway an overwatch shoot will be as much nasty than a RF. > - Kill, there’s often a part of risk here, but you can have some soldiers that can one shot kill such RF crabs. If you have ways to lower HP before it can work. > - Panic, well I don’t remind if it blocks a RF, worth a check. The point is often panic is more an opportunity to manage another target before. > - Cover without side step. Cover with side step are the worse but low cover with stand up aren’t much better. There’s a few high cover not requiring side step, it’s a bit less worse in term of global damages alas it tends end with heads damages and will lost. ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2020, 8:06pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/7 "2020-01-30T20:06:29Z")
> [@Zzzz](#): > > It’s not that situational when you start try exploit it… > > …But with experience/practice it’s a tool that can be used more and more often, even if not that often. I feel that this edit of your post addresses itself but… why can’t it be used that often? Because it requires you to be in a particular… situation, perhaps? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Zzzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f0a364/32.png) [@Zzzz](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Zzzz)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2020, 8:09pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/8 "2020-01-30T20:09:11Z")
> [@Lunazathoth](#): > > > [@Zzzz](#): > > > > It’s not that situational when you start try exploit it… > > > > …But with experience/practice it’s a tool that can be used more and more often, even if not that often. > > I feel that this edit of your post addresses itself but… why can’t it be used that often? Because it requires you to be in a particular… situation, perhaps? 😉 No the point is move, position and choose target to trigger it. I started have some success to trigger it, I suspect it can be improved in term of identifying the possibilities to setup attacks triggering it. EDIT: There’s even an improved version of it, but last patch Dash nerf, lowered widely the use cases. It’s or it was to trigger a RF mainly hurting another enemy between you and your target. ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2020, 8:23pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/9 "2020-01-30T20:23:53Z")
I think we’re talking about different things, you’ve lost me here. What do Dash and the fact the RF mechanic can be exploited have to do with anything? How is your example of using a different enemy to block LOS fundamentally different from mine of using a tree? How are any of these not dependant on everything’s placement on the map (I.E. the current situation)? **TLDR -** u wot m8? ---
**Author:** ![Zzzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f0a364/32.png) [@Zzzz](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Zzzz)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2020, 8:28pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/10 "2020-01-30T20:28:51Z")
Old Dash was allowing extra precision and versability in mobility. You was dashing then had one or two move precise up to the square. This extreme versatility was allowing move so an enemy is between you and your RF target, you shoot, then you move to a smarter position. New dash doesn’t allow it. The difference is the crab will RF anyway and damages an ally, with one shoot you damage two enemies. ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2020, 8:39pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/11 "2020-01-30T20:39:04Z")
We’re the only ones talking about Dash though, and even then my only contribution to that is to ask you why you’re bringing Dash up lol. It’s literally not relevant to the discussion, and even if it was, how does bringing up how it used to work help OP now that it works differently? Again, maybe I’ve just misunderstood you, but it seems to me that you told me I’m wrong for using the term “situational” and then just used a more roundabout way of explaining that exploiting it like that is indeed situational. Not only that, but I put it to you that lining up two enemies for this tactic is even more situational than lining one up with some scenery; two moving parts versus one. Basically, I’m just not sure what your point of contention is, other than one of semantics. ---
**Author:** ![Zzzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f0a364/32.png) [@Zzzz](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Zzzz)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2020, 10:21pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/12 "2020-01-30T22:21:36Z")
Situational as any way to manage RF and many other aspects of combats. For Dash I already explained, you disagree it’s relevant, ok. Point of contention? In list from an older post, I already listed the point you quoted, I can’t disagree, I was agree before it happened. Semantics, yeah, isn’t everything is semantics. ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2020, 11:34pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/13 "2020-01-30T23:34:48Z")
> [@Zzzz](#): > > For Dash I already explained, you disagree it’s relevant, ok. My point here is that you can’t use it as a means to avoid RF, RF doesn’t care how you got to the tile from which you’re attacking. Dash provides no defense buff or anything like that, it’s just movement. OP is asking how to avoid RF; it’s not like you can Dash away from RF as it will trigger before you get control of your unit back. Obviously I’m still not understanding you here as I believe you know all this. > [@Zzzz](#): > > isn’t everything is semantics. Not even gonna argue with this lol I want it on a t-shirt if anything. ---
**Author:** ![Zzzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f0a364/32.png) [@Zzzz](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Zzzz)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2020, 6:52am UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/14 "2020-01-31T06:52:12Z")
Old Dash was a better indirect tool to avoid RF through positioning, nothing more. ---
**Author:** ![pantolomin](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/pantolomin/32/1398_2.png) [@pantolomin](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/pantolomin)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2020, 10:18am UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/15 "2020-01-31T10:18:54Z")
I’ve had an idea for a mod that I will try to implement: - Return fire is not limited to the target (so 3 Arthrons might shoot at you) - … but limited to their orientation - if you shoot them in the back, they can’t return fire - will try to add a parameter to set an angle, default being 180° - there is already something like that for infiltrator applying shock when shooting so I’ll see if it is possible for RF ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2020, 11:58am UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/16 "2020-01-31T11:58:46Z")
Right, thanks for implying I was stupid so you could make your pointless contribution then. ---
**Author:** ![Vipre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/838e76/32.png) [@Vipre](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Vipre)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2020, 1:12pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/17 "2020-01-31T13:12:00Z")
I’d love to see that. ---
**Author:** ![pantolomin](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/pantolomin/32/1398_2.png) [@pantolomin](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/pantolomin)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2020, 12:21am UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/18 "2020-02-02T00:21:56Z")
Done and available on Nexus. I tried to see if I could make return fire trigger after going back to cover … it is possible, but I need to learn IL code to transpile some methods. So maybe later … ---
**Author:** ![Lunazathoth](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/lunazathoth/32/2305_2.png) [@Lunazathoth](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/Lunazathoth)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2020, 12:25am UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/19 "2020-02-02T00:25:02Z")
You’re a gift, pantolomin 🥰 ---
**Author:** ![pantolomin](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forums.snapshotgames.com/pantolomin/32/1398_2.png) [@pantolomin](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/u/pantolomin)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 8:37pm UTC](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169/20 "2020-02-07T20:37:50Z")
By the way, I updated the mod to have turrets handled separately. Since RF is their lone purpose, it’s only fair that they don’t get nerfed by this mod. Also, their perception being 20, I changed their ratio to 1 so that they can RF on their whole perception range (they are robots, they react to the full extent of their perception). And I now ship the properties file with the DLL. It was stupid to make them separate downloads from the start. [Next page](https://forums.snapshotgames.com/t/arthrons-reaction-fire/9169.md?page=2)